Want to discuss Thomas a bit

For discussion of Matt Reeve's Film Let Me In

Moderator: LMI Moderator

Post Reply
Keepitreal
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 7:50 am

Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by Keepitreal » Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:28 pm

First of all, I wish there were more fanfiction about Abby and Thomas, or the prequel to Let Me In. I think a story about Thomas and Abby’s relationship from beginning to end would be just as beautiful as the story in LMI.

I was thinking of how their relationship was like when Thomas is in his 20's, 30's, and 40's. I imagine that when he was still a little boy, he would be submissive to Abby. But as he grew up an adult(in his 20's), he would start to take charge and be the dominant one in the relationship. He'd get frustrated and angry more times than being happy which makes me think Abby would be submissive to Thomas because he's a grown man with a bad temper from all the stress and killing. He’s not a pushover until he becomes an old man in LMI, and even then the old thomas wasn't always a pushover since he did yell at Abby too. I wonder how often did they go on dates, and what did they do for fun. Was Abby still sexually attracted to Thomas when he is in his 20'sand 30's? Does Thomas still see her as his lover when he is in his 20's and 30's or more like a little sister/daughter? It’s hard for me to even imagine what their conversations used to be like since we never see them having a casual conversation in the movie. I wonder if he ever attempted to abandon Abby and start a new life over, he must have thought about this, like really contemplating whether this is what he wants to do for the rest of his life. I imagine he did leave Abby when she was asleep only to return to her days after because he cares for her too much.

I also noticed that in LMI, the victims Thomas chooses are all highschool male students. He doesn't target old people or young women which is what he should do since they are much weaker. These young male students he chooses look very similar to the kids that were bullying Owen. Compare Kenny to the 2 guys Thomas was killing. Maybe Thomas was bullied just like Owen by those same types of young males. He's killing out of revenge, which makes me think that's how he was able to do this for 40 years. He has no remorse or guilt for killing them because in his mind, they were all the same type of students who most likely bully kids like Owen and Thomas. In LMI, Thomas' misery had nothing to do with guilt of killing so many people. He was miserable only because their relationship/marriage was falling apart and at its end.

There’s 2 things I’m trying to figure out. Why didn’t Abby hide the jogger’s body and why didn’t Abby turn Thomas into a vampire?

Abby hid the detective’s body, so why didn’t she do the same for the Jogger’s. In fact, I’m starting to wonder why Thomas has to do the killing. Abby could kill a human herself, and Thomas would just sit back and wait until she’s finished and then hide the body himself.


As for why Thomas wasn’t turned to a vampire. .
1.Thomas asked her to, Abby refused. Either because she doesn’t want Thomas to suffer this curse, or that she didn’t turn him because if Thomas becomes a vampire, he will be in control of this relationship.(maybe both)
2.Abby wanted to turn him, but Thomas refused. Thomas doesn’t want to be a vampire.(unlikely)
3.Both of them never thought of this, so it was never discussed.(unlikely)

As for Abby being a manipulator. Not every boy Abby falls in love with would be as devoted, skilled, and dedicated as Thomas was. It’s nothing that you can predict by just looking at a 12 year old boy. I don’t buy that every kid is going to grow up and have what it takes to become a serial killer, no matter how much a boy might love Abby. Because I have a hard time believing Owen is able to become a serial killer. He’s so conflicted about good vs evil, right or wrong, and he’s just so physically weak. So I think Thomas is one of a kind, and Abby was lucky for finding someone like him. Is it possible Thomas was Abby’s first caretaker? Maybe. This leads to my 3rd point about Thomas not being turned. Since she never thought about this, Abby will learn from this mistake by turning Owen into a vampire.

Abby telling Owen to “hit back hard” could possibly be for Abby to put Owen in a situation where he needs to be rescued. But here’s the thing, if Abby was manipulating Owen by closely watching him as she pretends to “go away”, then she had to consider the possibility that the bullies might strike Owen in broad daylight. If that happened, there is no way Abby could save Owen. Either she was gambling on this or Abby really did go away only to sense Owen was in danger.

Abby being cold towards Thomas after he botched his first job could be justified. As shown, when Abby is hungry she’s in pain, like her body is decaying or something, which means she would be in a very foul mood. Abby yelling at Thomas is a natural human response, there’s nothing evil behind it IMO. Just a typical fight that I imagine they had many times before.

What do you guys think?

User avatar
a_contemplative_life
Moderator
Posts: 5896
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:06 am
Location: Virginia, USA

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by a_contemplative_life » Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:49 am

I hope some of you LMI fans will respond to this post...
Image

User avatar
lombano
Posts: 2993
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 9:56 pm
Location: Xalapa, Mexico
Contact:

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by lombano » Fri Jan 17, 2014 7:20 am

I think the reason Thomas does the killing is simply that Abby is too reckless to be trusted with it - witness how she attacks Virginia right in front of witnesses, close to her home, etc. Incidentally, this makes the interpretation of Abby as purely manipulative pretty implausible (though, as you note, Owen is rather obviously unfit as a guardian, which completely rules out the interpretation of Abby as purely manipulative).
It's an interesting point that Thomas consistently kills teenage boys and that it might be some kind of revenge. I also don't think it's all about the killing per se, I don't think he's bothered by it, but I hadn't considered the possibility he might even view it as some kind of public service.
Last edited by lombano on Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Bli mig lite.

User avatar
DavidZahir
Posts: 694
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 4:24 am

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by DavidZahir » Sun Jan 26, 2014 5:09 pm

The pattern of who Thomas killed isn't something I'd considered before! Another factor might also be projected envy/rage at his own lost youth. These are the young men who are living the kind of normal lives Thomas never, ever had.

Why didn't Abby turn Thomas? I can see all sorts of reasons, none of them mutually exclusive. In terms of raw practicality, someone has to go into the sunlight at times, while two vampires frankly doubles the chance of discovery (twice as many bodies at least). On a visceral level, I also get the impression Abby loathes the vampire within her, that she doesn't want another such creature anywhere near her.

My guess from early on was that Thomas began killing for Abby as a kind of gift, a way to win her favor as he grew older. Over time it became a habit, a rhythm in their lives much like the patterns married couples fall into. Rather like the 'son' in Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe? wherein George reacted so very strongly once Martha broke the cardinal rule of their relationship. By Abby hunting on her own, she broke a unwritten covenant with Thomas. Which gives added emotional power to the scene where he plans on going out to kill once more. He's trying to fix what has gone wrong between them.

Perhaps we should also keep in mind the raw logistics of someone Abby's size moving the dead weight of an adult! Yeah, she's incredibly strong, but that doesn't mean she could easily drag along something that size. She isn't Superman, able to bend metal or crush bricks with her bare hands. At least we never see her use that level of strength. And I imagine on an emotional level she's still sharing the process with Thomas by having him dispose of the body. Because theirs has clearly degenerated into a dysfunctional relationship, like a bitter unhappy marriage between people who still care for each other but also harbor mountains of resentments.

On reflection, I don't suppose all of Abby's companions kill for her. My guess is, Thomas was unusual in that respect. Owen as he matures is more likely do things like rent apartments and arrange movement of their belongings during the day, help clean Abby and buy her fresh clothes--sometimes help dispose of bodies. Remember when we meet Abby she's weak, hasn't fed in who-knows-how-long. I got the impression her display of savage power at the pool was something she simply could not do at the start of the movie--not until after draining about four adults. Recall her first kill, in which she lured someone close to her, as opposed to simply sweeping down and attacking a victim as we see her do later. Keep in mind that 'smell' she had at first never seems to return after one feeding, nor does she behave again as she did when meeting Owen, clutching her audibly growling stomach! This suggests to me she was pretty far into vampiric malnutrition when she arrived. Thomas had been failing her for awhile, then.
O let my name be in the Book of Love. If it be there I care not
For that Other great Book above. Strike it out! Or write it in anew--
But let My name be in the Book of Love!
-- Omar Kayam

User avatar
gkmoberg1
Moderator
Posts: 4245
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2010 4:46 am
Contact:

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by gkmoberg1 » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:45 pm

The Thomas we see in the movie seems given over to resignation and defeat. The relationship with Abby is decaying as he ages. The joy he once found in their being together has worn away. He's tired of the needs placed upon him and burnt out. For him, there is nothing coming in the future that makes continuing worthwhile. There is a similar frustration and resignation expressed by Abby. Hers is in a different form. There is the outright frustration over his lack of returning with food when he goes off and kills Scott. That does seem understandable in the context of where the two are, as the OP points out. But the kitchen scene shows a different angle on the situation. She approaches him. True, he is preparing to go out again and her coming up to him could be taken as solely a reassurance that what he's doing is appreciated. But could also be a moment where she is remembering and sharing the sadness of all that's come and gone between them. I propose that it's a bit of both; it's a very loaded moment of their dark world.

That is an excellent point about Thomas targeting teenage boys.

As to why Abby does not turn Thomas, I prefer DavidZahir's " I also get the impression Abby loathes the vampire within her" as the core reason. She hates what she is; why would she allow it to happen to others whom she is attached to?

Zahir's "that she doesn't want another such creature anywhere near her" is a separate thorn. This leads to further avenues of speculation such as 1. vampires are loners and seek distance from each other ; thus to turn Thomas would drive him away from her , 2. she's done this before - turned her helper/assistant/friend - and this came to a bad end (separation/violence/etc.).

'lombano' has a good point with the suggesting that Thomas does the killing because she is too reckless. Mistakes made by either of them force them to move on to a new location, new identity, and so on. Relocating is an effort that would be largely his task to undertake because he can be out in the daytime doing the visits, arrangements, paperwork, and phone calls. I'm sure it's frustrating for him as things continue to deteriorate between him and Abby to have relocate again and yet again- especially when it is her actions that bring on the need to find a new place. It could, then, well be that he has only recently taken on doing the killing. This explains why he is doing so badly at it; because he's new and inexperienced at it. After all the presumed years of their time together you have to assume he'd be a far more clever hunter/killer than the Thomas we see stumbling about in the woods and hiding in backseats. What I'm suggesting is that the change of who does the killing has only but recently occurred. He's not doing well at it and it's driving additional friction into their relationship.

User avatar
gkmoberg1
Moderator
Posts: 4245
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2010 4:46 am
Contact:

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by gkmoberg1 » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:54 pm

I don't think there is enough evidence to say that Abby does not hide her victim's bodies. How do we know that Abby does not hide the bodies? There was no chance to deal with the bodies at the pool massacre and the attack on Virginia is cut off. Meanwhile, the detective IS hidden, likely be both children. The only body that might not have been hidden was the jogger's. But we don't know whether she hid it or not. For all we know she did. If so, the argument Owen overhears and the hiding we see Thomas perform is in reaction to Thomas' being upset about where she did choose to hide the body. He doesn't want to have to relocated yet again. What she has done jeopardizes there new identity and location. I'm sure she's extremely aware of the same. So it _is_ likely that she hid the jogger's body. Which means Thomas' foul reaction and subsequent relocation of the body is one driven by his exasperation with their situation and is part of the struggle over whom is to be hunting- which as conjectured in my prior post might be a recent change in their habits, one that is not going well and so is a point of strife.

User avatar
lombano
Posts: 2993
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 9:56 pm
Location: Xalapa, Mexico
Contact:

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by lombano » Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:59 pm

DavidZahir wrote:The pattern of who Thomas killed isn't something I'd considered before! Another factor might also be projected envy/rage at his own lost youth. These are the young men who are living the kind of normal lives Thomas never, ever had.
Yes - we know almost nothing about his youth, but we do know a couple of things: Once on the run with Abby, any possibility of a normal life was gone. The other, his life must've been pretty bad for him to prefer that to whatever he had before. On both counts, he may well feel a lot of envy for young men leading lives both normal and happy. We have no particular reason to assume his tormentors were mainly young men (one imagines he was a social outcast, but there could've been tons of other things going on on top of bullying by his peers), so revenge seems more of an assumption, but there must've definitely have been envy. Targeting someone who had a car or at least drove one, had friends, etc makes sense.
Bli mig lite.

Keepitreal
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 7:50 am

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by Keepitreal » Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:10 pm

gkmoberg1 wrote:But the kitchen scene shows a different angle on the situation. She approaches him. True, he is preparing to go out again and her coming up to him could be taken as solely a reassurance that what he's doing is appreciated. But could also be a moment where she is remembering and sharing the sadness of all that's come and gone between them. I propose that it's a bit of both; it's a very loaded moment of their dark world.
I also thought alot about the kitchen scene. In the "Abby's body language thread" you said
gkmoberg1 wrote:This would be a difficult transition for Abby. She's just returned from a fun evening with Owen and then walks into the darkened kitchen to find Thomas preparing yet again for the necessary task of going off hunting for her. The long stares from her are combative but are not meant as outright confrontation. Yet she's not going to agree to his request that she not see Owen again, and in the end he knows he's lost. The touch, though, is tender. Is this manipulative? Or simply remembrance? - We know from the photo that they've been together for a long long time. Yes, she's being manipulative in a small way. But if this was outright sinister manipulation, he's been around her long enough that he'd know. And he doesn't react that way. Rather, he stays with the misery of watching their relationship decay. In short: she uses her body language far more than speech to say both that she still cares for him and that she does intend to see Owen again - and that she is denying his request for her to stop.
I don't know if this is consider "seeing that boy". When Thomas left to go for the 2nd hunt, Abby was still in her apartment. She could've sneaked out and went to Owen's apartment to SEE him. But instead she stays in her room, and just lies down near the wall close to where Owen is.

Is her communicating to Owen through morse code considered "seeing Owen"? I don't know. If no, then Abby did accept Thomas' request, even though she did not like it. If yes, then Abby disobeyed Thomas.

User avatar
gkmoberg1
Moderator
Posts: 4245
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2010 4:46 am
Contact:

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by gkmoberg1 » Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:45 pm

She must have felt very torn during that evening. She's been with Thomas for very long - decades. They know each other completely. Yet he has become much older and the dyanmic has become overrun with pain and conflict. Then, against this background there is for her the enticing and budding friendship with the naive boy next door. He's her age, has her energy and sees things as children do - not as Thomas does. It must be like a rush of fresh air for her. And so it is with agony that she tries to uphold both relationships. Had Thomas returned that night and for many nights thereafter, this would have been impossible for her to maintain. She'd eventually have to cast one or the other away - it would seem. As things turn out, though, she doesn't have to come that point. But for that evening alone in the apartment, yes I think she's caught up in trying to keep Thomas' wishes and yet is filled with thoughts about Owen.

Dracula
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:42 am
Location: Transylvania

Re: Want to discuss Thomas a bit

Post by Dracula » Sat Jun 07, 2014 6:56 pm

What do you think Thomas was thinking at the end.

Post Reply

Return to “Let Me In”