Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" Abby?

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gkmoberg1
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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by gkmoberg1 » Wed Jul 02, 2014 3:20 am

Alice?Maybe wrote:... Even so, I wasn't particularly fond of her "using" Thomas, although she did display a little affection for him, or was playing to what she knew he would like (she does have a thing for doing what people want if they show disappointment, candy, going steady. ...
I don't see her as "using" Thomas. What I see is a relationship that has run its course, neither Thomas nor her know what to do with the remainder.

For decades their life together is all they've had. Yet this time is at an end. And while they both know this, neither knows what to do next nor looks willing to break up the relationship that they've had for so long. Thomas has run out of energy. He appears to be burnt out on the mechanics of how their arrangement has worked. He tells her that maybe he wants to get caught, right? He's tired of this road they've been on but doesn't know what to do. I think the same is true for her, but her being 12, she doesn't process the situation as he does. Her feelings are not of the same maturity and her intellect is not able to decide upon an mature action - so nothing happens.

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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by Alice?Maybe » Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:11 am

gkmoberg1 wrote:
Alice?Maybe wrote:... Even so, I wasn't particularly fond of her "using" Thomas, although she did display a little affection for him, or was playing to what she knew he would like (she does have a thing for doing what people want if they show disappointment, candy, going steady. ...
I don't see her as "using" Thomas. What I see is a relationship that has run its course, neither Thomas nor her know what to do with the remainder.

For decades their life together is all they've had. Yet this time is at an end. And while they both know this, neither knows what to do next nor looks willing to break up the relationship that they've had for so long. Thomas has run out of energy. He appears to be burnt out on the mechanics of how their arrangement has worked. He tells her that maybe he wants to get caught, right? He's tired of this road they've been on but doesn't know what to do. I think the same is true for her, but her being 12, she doesn't process the situation as he does. Her feelings are not of the same maturity and her intellect is not able to decide upon an mature action - so nothing happens.

Good point.

I get the feeling, because it's what I want?, that Abby cares more for Owen than she ever did for Thomas. I have nothing I can point to exactly in support of this feeling.

It's probably in the threads somewhere, but in the credits Thomas is simply referred to as "The Father" how do we know his name?
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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by sauvin » Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:55 am

Alice?Maybe wrote: I get the feeling, because it's what I want?, that Abby cares more for Owen than she ever did for Thomas. I have nothing I can point to exactly in support of this feeling.
The movie doesn't give us much to go on, one way or another. They apparently met when Thomas was twelve; Thomas went on to become an "older" boy, a teenager, a young man, a young man in his prime, a not so young man until he turned into what we saw. He was never able to stay in one place in lots of ways, where Abby had no choice but to stay put.

What we saw in the movie was how this process ended for these two people. One piece of evidence offered for their first days or weeks together are the expressions on their faces in the photo strip where Abby doesn't really look all that happy. Another is where Abby barges into the bedroom in order to practise her newfound Morse code skills, and Thomas is seen venerating that very same photo strip (if memory serves). For some reason, that 'veneration' speaks more loudly to me than Abby's "not really happy" expression in those photos - maybe Abby just wasn't happy about having her picture taken. For Thomas, at least, it seems those photos bring back very pleasant memories.

There's a thread somewhere on this board that hotly debates just how differently Abby might have seen Thomas while he was still twelve from how she now sees Owen at the same age. I don't remember any good keywords to search on, so I'll have to do some wading to locate it again - pester me and I'll (eventually) dig it up.

I suppose a lot of it depends on what you want to see, but Grumpy Old Man Sauvin doesn't see anything to firmly support the argument that anything would necessarily be any different. There's nothing to preclude the possibility that there'd been men like Thomas in Abby's life before, and with Owen now coming into her life, there's the really squicky feeling there'll be such a man again. I call these "Thomas Cycles" (tm); if they'd occurred more than a couple of times, part of Abby's depressed resignation and apparent general aloofness towards Grumpier Old Man Thomas may well stem from having had to endure this phase of the cycle before without having found a good way to live with it, except maybe find a new boy/man and elope. The fact that she hadn't done precisely this years before suggests some kind of bond that mere convenience can't explain, and that Thomas and Abby really had been - and remain - a couple.
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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by gymmy64 » Wed Jul 02, 2014 3:22 pm

Alice?Maybe wrote: It's probably in the threads somewhere, but in the credits Thomas is simply referred to as "The Father" how do we know his name?
In an early version of the script, the character's name is revealed; apparently at some point Reeves chose to not refer to him by name. I can't put my hands on that script at the moment, but I can link to sketches that were drawn for the "Let Me In" "Prequel" comic:

http://splashpage.mtv.com/2010/08/02/le ... -sketches/

If I remember correctly, the creative team was furnished early versions of the script and the project was underway before the release of the film, so that would explain why the character's name is used. As you noted, the credits lists him as "The Father". We know that he isn't, of course, and considering his importance in Abby's life, he deserved to be referred to by name, as opposed to "Abby's Guardian", "that guy", etc.

I also remember that in an early draft, Thomas actually speaks to Owen and says something to the effect of, "I was just like you once." There was a time when these drafts were readily available online, I dunno if that is still the case. I'll check my own records to see if I still have any of them.
Last edited by gymmy64 on Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by Alice?Maybe » Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:15 pm

gymmy64 wrote:
Alice?Maybe wrote: It's probably in the threads somewhere, but in the credits Thomas is simply referred to as "The Father" how do we know his name?
In an early version of the script, the character's name is reavealed; apparently at some point Reeves chose to not refer to him by name. I can't put my hands on that script at the moment, but I can link to sketches that were drawn for the "Let Me In" "Prequel" comic:

http://splashpage.mtv.com/2010/08/02/le ... -sketches/

If I remember correctly, the creative teram was furnished early versions of the script and the project was underway before the release of the film, so that would explain why the character's name is used. As you noted, the credits lists him as "The Father". We know that he isn't, of course, and considering his importance in Abby's life, he deserved to be referred to by name, as opposed to "Abby's Guardian", "that guy", etc.

I also remember that in an early draft, Thomas actually speaks to Owen and says some to the effect of, "I was just like you once." There was a time when these drafts were readily available online, I dunno if that is still the case. I'll check my own records to see if I still have any of them.
Thank you. I suspected some such source as I know it wasn't just made up by fans. You are right, I am far more comfortable with calling him by name than some impersonal label. As you say the character deserves it.
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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by gkmoberg1 » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:03 am

Alice?Maybe wrote:I get the feeling, because it's what I want?, that Abby cares more for Owen than she ever did for Thomas. I have nothing I can point to exactly in support of this feeling.
Sure. I want that too. It's the nature of movies: to root for the protagonists and the underdogs. And in this case they are one and the same. So, naturally, I want to see Owen be more than just another 'The Father' to Abby. And I want their relationship to somehow magically go on forever and be golden.

Yet in the world of vampirism, while there can be an element of 'magic' hanging over it all, there's little chance at Happily Ever After. But for as long as I can, I toss that aside and root for the underdogs and that they can somehow have a lasting time together that is special for them.

But should this be something more special than what Abby once had with 'That Guy' ? I'm sure back when he was her age it would have been a similar head-over-heals/puppy-love moment. And maybe back that time - several decades ago - there was a similar scene (in these 'Thomas Cycles' (tm)sauvin ) where an older 'Hey You' stood by the window and watched what once was slip away.

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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by gkmoberg1 » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:09 am

I encourage you to read LetMeIn-2 down in the Fan Fiction basement. It was originally posted on fanfiction.net . The author is now writing a prequel for LMI, one that delves into Abby's past. They are well worth reading.

[ Edit: 'Fan Fiction basement' was a term thought up by tjippiflax, to the best of my knowledge. I rather miss her presence here... it's been a long time. :sadness: ]

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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by Alice?Maybe » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:16 am

gkmoberg1 wrote:
Alice?Maybe wrote:I get the feeling, because it's what I want?, that Abby cares more for Owen than she ever did for Thomas. I have nothing I can point to exactly in support of this feeling.
Sure. I want that too. It's the nature of movies: to root for the protagonists and the underdogs. And in this case they are one and the same. So, naturally, I want to see Owen be more than just another 'The Father' to Abby. And I want their relationship to somehow magically go on forever and be golden.

Yet in the world of vampirism, while there can be an element of 'magic' hanging over it all, there's little chance at Happily Ever After. But for as long as I can, I toss that aside and root for the underdogs and that they can somehow have a lasting time together that is special for them.

But should this be something more special than what Abby once had with 'That Guy' ? I'm sure back when he was her age it would have been a similar head-over-heals/puppy-love moment. And maybe back that time - several decades ago - there was a similar scene (in these 'Thomas Cycles' (tm)sauvin ) where an older 'Hey You' stood by the window and watched what once was slip away.
We approach it from different perspectives. I want it for Abby. I want her relationship with Owen to be part of her healing. Yes, I would feel bad for Owen if she were to be done with him like she was with Thomas, but I'd feel worse for her, her humanity/humanness. Not healing from vampirism, but emotionally from the trauma and life she has been forced to live as a result. Some contentment and not just resignation to a life she had no control in choosing, a move away from, "That's just the way it is." My heart breaks and aches for her much more than for Owen. Owen wil grow, mature, get therapy and overcome the bullying of his childhood. Abby has no such future in any normal sense, but could she find a degree of healing? I think so. I think Owen could be the catalyst, maybe that's a bad metaphor because he will be forever changed, too.
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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by gkmoberg1 » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:44 am

Yes, of course. It's a relationship, meaning it has to work for both him & her. They need to find in each other comfort and ways of healing from their past experiences and then build new times together. The romantic in me wants all this to happen and wants it to work. The realist in me shudders at what is likely the depth of Abby's torment.

Prying into what we can find in the movie that gives us any insight on Abby is my favorite way to rewatch the film. She is so distraught and shut down, it's hard to watch. Literally, it's painful to see the suffering she is in. (Which is why her smile, fleeting as it is, becomes so memorable.) I feel that throughout most of the movie she is shedding cloak after clock of mental separation she has wrapped her self into in order to survive what she is and how she is faring and how she and Thomas are faring. Wouldn't wish it on anyone.

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Re: Do you think that Reeve denied us the chance to "love" A

Post by sauvin » Thu Jul 03, 2014 3:11 am

gkmoberg1 wrote:Prying into what we can find in the movie that gives us any insight on Abby is my favorite way to rewatch the film. She is so distraught and shut down, it's hard to watch. Literally, it's painful to see the suffering she is in.
"I told you we couldn't be friends" says Abby as Owen is storming out her apartment. Yea, it can be hard to take at times.
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