Sooo...my thoughts...

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CyberGhostface
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Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by CyberGhostface » Sun Mar 27, 2011 7:16 pm

Apologies if this is jumbled as I'm just writing what comes to mind. If I didn't cover something feel free to ask what I thought on it.

So I just finished watching LMI for the first time in one sitting on my television. I had seen it before in bits and pieces on my computer but I wanted to wait before making any serious discussion on the matter until I could see it the way it was intended to be seen.

First off, if you're going to go to say "Well, you never would have liked it" then do us both a favor and just click out now. For what it's worth while I'm not a fan of Reeves' actions in promoting the film, I did my best to distance my personal feelings and focus on the film itself more. I mean, heck, James Cameron sounds a bit like a douchebag (telling his actors to piss themselves lest they take off their costume in the middle of shooting) but I still think Aliens is a great film. I even withheld from rewatching the Swedish film (haven't seen it since last September). If there was never a chance of me finding anything positive, I would have forsaken seeing it entirely. So yeah, I was hoping I could come away from it and go "Well, at least that part was good" or "So and so gave a good performance" even I thought that the overall fim was a waste of time.

Overall? I was surprised at how apathetic I was. You may have expected me to be gnashing my teeth while watching the film, but I just couldn't bring myself to care. So I didn't hate the film, but I left thinking "So what?" I couldn't bring myself to have any interest in the characters or the plot. I'm not particularly proud of this as I was hoping to get a more emotional reaction out of it for good or bad. Now you may say this is because I saw the original first but A.) I've already seen LTROI three times and I've liked it more each time and B.) I saw both True Grits in the span of one week and I had no problem liking the Coen Brothers' version significantly better.

It just felt rushed. I don't know how given that both films are two hours and there is less focus on the subplots than there was in the first film, but the plot didn't seem to breathe. It went through the motions but I didn't get the heart that the Swedish film had. Whenever Reeves copied scenes from the Alfredson film it just paled that much more in comparison. Maybe Reeves thought "If it worked for them, it'll work for me" but obviously that didn't happen.

For example: the "invite" scene. Just the look on Eli's face throughout or Oskar's prodding with the "tsk tsk". Little details like that. The bleeding scene itself was more effective with the close-ups and sound effects. I just didn't get the impact that the Swedish film had from LMI. The same thing happens, but that's it. "End of scene, let's get to the next one." Or when Abby feeds on Thomas? After not showing his face in the opening scene, Reeves shows his scarred face with little fanfare and then its done with. In the original, we don't see Hakan's face until the end and it's far more unsettling and disturbing.

The acting/characters: A lot of people have pointed out that whereas Alfredson apparently told the kids what to do specifically, Reeves took Spielberg's advice and let the kids act the way they wanted to. Or something like that. All I have to say is...if both films are representative of the different types of directing style, then I would much prefer the directors tell the kids what to do to the smallest detail. I am utterly baffled at how anyone could say Kodi and Chloe did better than Kare and Lina. Pretty much all the complaints I've heard about the Swedish kids seemed to multiply tenfold in the remake.

For what it's worth, I did like Kodi. He felt like an awkward kid making friends for the first time, and I sympathized with him quite a bit. His best scene IMO was when he called his father on the phone. Didn't like him as much as Kare, but he gave one of the better performances in the film. I'm going to say the problems I had with him had to do with the script and not his performance.

Chloe on the other hand, except for a couple of scenes (like when she killed Thomas) felt stiff. I liked her in Kick-Ass, but here it just felt like someone acting and not really "being" the character. Even the scenes with her smiling felt unnatural. I felt her performance in Kick-Ass was much better, so I don't think she's a bad actress or anything. I mean look at the scene in Kick-Ass when her father dies for example.

With the bullies, the only thing I liked was the scene where we see that the older brother was bullying the younger one. Besides that, they left me cold. Compare the original where we see the kid is crying as he's hitting Oskar because the other one is goading him into doing it and the scene in the remake where the kid doing it is just being nasty with no conscience. They were there, and that's it.

One thing I was wrong about was Jenkins. He was the one I expected to like the best and upon watching it again, I have to say that I was disappointed. Not so much with his acting perse but his arc felt rushed and I didn't find myself caring about what happened to him--even when I should be sympathizing with him more as he's much more Abby's victim here. Again, I can't put a finger on it as he more or less had the same scenes as Per Ragnar did. I know Ragnar had the scene with him at the cafe which showed how lonely and detached he was, forsaking the potential friendship with Lacke and friends, so maybe that's it? If so, mark that up to another casualty of cutting out that particular subplot. The car scene was effective from a visual standpoint, but I found Ragnar's quiet desperation in the original before pouring the acid to be far more heartbreaking than anything in the remake. And of course, we need more gore and we need to see the acid melting him while he screams in pain. *sighs*

Probably the biggest thing I was wrong about was the cop. In the script, he was essentially a bland proxy for Lacke's storyline, to give Abby and Owen an antagonist and for someone to become vampire chow at the end. Well, that still may be the case, but I thought Koteas did a great job with what he had and I would daresay he gave a better performance than whoever played Lacke in the Swedish film. The best of both worlds would have be to have Koteas play Lacke or combine Lacke's subplot with the cop's as Lacke is still a more interesting character and his storyline more rewarding. But yeah, I think Koteas gave the best performance second to Kodi. And a small thing, but I thought his "look" with the oversized glasses and mustache gave him more character than your typical grizzled cop. So he definitely salvaged what would have been a one-note subplot.

The screenplay/plot: Well, I've already discussed ad nauseaum how Reeves forsook the book for copying the Swedish screenplay, so I'll just leave it at that. I will say that when watching the opening scene I was slightly optimistic because it was effective and well-done in terms of set-up and music but after that the film started sinking.

Reeves actually surprised me with how much he overexplained everything, even moreso than I thought from the script. See that photo of Abby and Thomas? Let's zoom in so the audience doesn't miss it! Or the scene after the bleeding "This is what happens if you don't let me in..." No sh_t, Sherlock. Or the addition of Romeo and Juliet--that was pretty much there so the audience would know where "I must be gone and live, or stay and die" came from as that was the exact scene showed from the movie. And just so we don't forget its significance--as soon as Owen reads the letter, we cut to him reading Romeo & Juliet!

Slight divergent: I read a short story about a character with a complicated relationship with his dad. There's a throwaway line about him reading a novel called The Demolished Man. Now if you were to read the referenced novel itself you would know that it's about someone who kills his father and what significance that had. The short story didn't explain that and you would only get the significance of its metaphor if you had read it. If Reeves had used R & J like that, I would give him points, but the way its handled was "See? SEE?! This is a reference to Romeo & Juliet! And in case you forget, here it is again!" C'mon Reeves. Show a little respect for your audience...please?

The few times where Reeves tried to "improve" the original's iconic scenes I couldn't help but laugh. The Virginia bed-scene was tragic in the original with her effectively committing suicide lest she succumb to the vampirism. The scene in the remake was comical in comparison with her going "Om nom nom" on her hand before the nurse opens the shades for her. And then when the nurse gets lit alight? Oh God. :lol:

The pool scene itself was a joke. Having body parts fly at the camera? Hearing people screaming and bones ripping? It was played just like another gory horror film.

Overall, the remake was pretty much what I expected it to be. I will say that I was pleasantly surprised in some aspects (Kodi's and Elias's performance) but overall it was like watching a subpar abridgment of the Swedish film. The story was simplified, the gore/special effects were predictably ramped up, the taboo elements were neutered and the heart was removed leaving behind a hollow husk. It could have been worse, I'll give it that, but there's no excuse for it to be as flat as it was.
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by bore » Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:28 pm

Since I mostly agree to everything you said I am just going to point out the thing where my opinion differs.

It seem to me like the phone call is the scene where LMI really shines. Those who hate LMI think that it is one of it redeeming qualities and those who love LMI argues that the phone call is one of it redeeming qualities.
When watching the phone call scene what impresses me the most is not Owens performance but the acting on the other side of the phone so to speak. I could really feel how Owens dad in that case was frustraded by being so far away from his son at that moment and that he, while he misunderstood the situation, really wanted to help resolving it.
I think it is quite impressive that an actor can "show" all those feelings with just voice acting.
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by abner_mohl » Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:38 pm

I think Elias Koteas also did the voice of Owen's dad, so again a credit to his acting abilities, definitely should have been cast as Lacke.

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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by cmfireflies » Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:59 pm

Just wanted to say about the phone call scene, I didn't like it that much. I mean, I get what it was going for that it really should have been more powerful, but it left me kind of cold.

I remember this quote that said "The tragedy of man is not that he fails, but that he almost succeeds" from somewhere. Owen's parents were just so completely emotionally distant (less so in LtROI) and oblivious to his problems (about the same in LtROI) that there was really no question that the dad will fail Owen. And although Kodi played Owen well, Owen's predominant mood throughout the movie I would have to say is fearful and sad, so the phone scene didn't really register as an emotional nadir for Owen even though it was clear supposed to be.

I think my favorite part of the movie would be the pool scene. It isn't as good as LtROI, but it fit more with the atmosphere of LMI: dark and chaotic, with a shot of Owen at Abby's bloodied feet (which I think is as close to restraint as MR was capable of showing outside of copying TA)

It does boggle the mind how the movie felt rushed when it covered less than the original.
I felt an obvious disconnect between the shot-for-shot remade scenes and the rest of the movie. The new scenes were more in-your-face: kinetic and brutal. The copied scenes were slow placed and roomy. So the bullying scenes and the murder scenes overshadowed the relationship scenes for me. What I didn't understand was that there was plenty of ways that Reeves could have avoided this by "following the book:" There could have been tension and energy in Owen's meeting with Abby if Reeves just did what he said he was going to do: ie. include the scene where Eli almost bites Oskar, include the scene where they play-fight, etc. Instead he took someone else's scenes which fit perfectly in their own movie and forced them into his own which had a completely different style.

I also hated the cop, less because of the acting, more because the role was simplified into "the detective that gets killed in the middle of the horror movie because he didn't believe in the supernatural monster"
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by danielma » Mon Mar 28, 2011 12:47 am

I pretty much agree with everything you said Cyber...there is just something about the film that feels artificial and hollow to me. I know everyone points out that the relationship between Owen and Abby seems warmer than that of Oskar and Eli, but to be honest, it just felt artificial and hollow to me. Like it was almost misleading you. The warmer tone of LMI ended up feeling completely artificial for some reason. And in the end, I don't know if I cared as much for Abby and Owen like I did for Eli and Oskar because of it.
For example: the "invite" scene. Just the look on Eli's face throughout or Oskar's prodding with the "tsk tsk". Little details like that. The bleeding scene itself was more effective with the close-ups and sound effects. I just didn't get the impact that the Swedish film had from LMI. The same thing happens, but that's it. "End of scene, let's get to the next one." Or when Abby feeds on Thomas? After not showing his face in the opening scene, Reeves shows his scarred face with little fanfare and then its done with. In the original, we don't see Hakan's face until the end and it's far more unsettling and disturbing.
The Invite scene was one of the scenes where I almost felt and wished that Reeves had just directly aped Alfredson's shots. The Invite scene, to be honest, did not look or perform well here. I think its the shooting choices, they have Abby in a dark shirt whilst having her bleed darkly colored blood. The blood on a dark shirt really didn't visuallize well in my opinion. It didn't read well I thought. Also the detached nature of that scene didn't really make me feel anything for Abby in that moment. They ramped up the blood in that scene (she bleeds much more than Eli) but in the process I felt they kind of lost something in their methods of shooting it. I liked the way Alfredson employed his close ups of Eli, it somehow worked in making me feel that scene. The close ups made it feel like a complete Hemorage of Rejection for Eli (to quote a certain critic). Where as I think Reeves kind of looses something in the process. The scene kind of just came and went and I don't know if I felt as much in that moment.

The other scene that comes to mind is the Bedroom scene, its such a pivotal scene in the original film and yet in the remake it kind of just came and went. I think with that scene in particular, its hurt by the fact that Reeves tries to copy Alfredson but at the same time tries to add his own touches by having Abby blurred as she is changing. However Reeves has already established that Blurred Trick as a way of showing disconnect between the Mother and Owen. Now that would be fine, but as the scene continues they kind of cut haphazardly back and forward between Owen and Abby and it somehow keeps the feeling of distance between them. Whether Reeves intended that or not, their is a feeling of distance in that scene. In a scene that is supposed to be an intimate one.
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by Nightrider » Mon Mar 28, 2011 2:51 am

Here's a thought...Let's say the original LTROI did not exist. On it's own, Let Me In would have been an interesting, if a bit simplistic version of JAL's novel. Would it set the world on fire? Probably not. Would it be a memorable film for the audience?
Possibly, if you consider favorable responses from most (but not all)people who seen it....If LTROI did not exist.... I'm not a fan of LMI, but let's be honest, Matt Reeves got saddled with unenviable task of recreating an almost identical version of beloved original film. Truly, there's no way remake could have succeeded while LTROI is around.
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So, in the end Let Me In is going to remain the film that will forever be compared to Let The Right One In and will forever lose that battle....because there's no substitutes. LTROI will always be a stronger, braver version of the book and LMI will be, but a footnote in the Chloe Moretz' resume, who will definitely will have very long ang successful movie career.
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by danielma » Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:02 am

Nightrider wrote:Here's a thought...Let's say the original LTROI did not exist. On it's own, Let Me In would have been an interesting, if a bit simplistic version of JAL's novel. Would it set the world on fire? Probably not. Would it be a memorable film for the audience?
.

But that's the problem Nightrider...we don't live in that alternate world...LTROI does exsist and its clear that is what LMI was heavily modeled after.

Its hard not to compare it when its so clear that LMI was heavily modeled after the original film.

But I'll play along. If LTROI (the film) never exsisted, I'd still be disapointed a little. I'd be disapointed in the major changes with the Hakan and Eli (or Thomas and Abby) relationship. The back story would have annoyed me even greater than what it already does as I really would have felt than even more so that they missed the point of the book completely. I don't know, if LTROI had never exsisted, to be honest, I probably would dislike LMI even more in some bizarre way.
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by Nightrider » Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:17 am

[quote="danielma
But that's the problem Nightrider...we don't live in that alternate world...LTROI does exsist and its clear that is what LMI was heavily modeled after.

Its hard not to compare it when its so clear that LMI was heavily modeled after the original film.

But I'll play along. If LTROI (the film) never exsisted, I'd still be disapointed a little. I'd be disapointed in the major changes with the Hakan and Eli (or Thomas and Abby) relationship. The back story would have annoyed me even greater than what it already does as I really would have felt than even more so that they missed the point of the book completely. I don't know, if LTROI had never exsisted, to be honest, I probably would dislike LMI even more in some bizarre way.[/quote]

danielma
I think you misunderstood my intentions. I am not a LMI apologist. Remaking LTROI was one of the worst ideas ever and was probably more of a financial decision then a creative one. I'm a huge fan of LTROI and was prompted to write about the two films simply because of the endless comparisons. The comparisons that will never end and will not solve a thing. So my thought was..what if the original never existed....and you know what? I still wouldn't like LMI any better..
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by danielma » Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:26 am

Nightrider wrote:[quote="danielma]
But that's the problem Nightrider...we don't live in that alternate world...LTROI does exsist and its clear that is what LMI was heavily modeled after.

Its hard not to compare it when its so clear that LMI was heavily modeled after the original film.

But I'll play along. If LTROI (the film) never exsisted, I'd still be disapointed a little. I'd be disapointed in the major changes with the Hakan and Eli (or Thomas and Abby) relationship. The back story would have annoyed me even greater than what it already does as I really would have felt than even more so that they missed the point of the book completely. I don't know, if LTROI had never exsisted, to be honest, I probably would dislike LMI even more in some bizarre way.
danielma
I think you misunderstood my intentions. I am not a LMI apologist. Remaking LTROI was one of the worst ideas ever and was probably more of a financial decision then a creative one. I'm a huge fan of LTROI and was prompted to write about the two films simply because of the endless comparisons. The comparisons that will never end and will not solve a thing. So my thought was..what if the original never existed....and you know what? I still wouldn't like LMI any better..
[/quote][/quote][/quote]


No, no I know...my tone came across wrong in that.

I was also throwing my hat into the same arguement...essentially we were agreeing, just my tone came off wrong :) So yeah we were essentially agreeing, sorry for the miscommunicated tone.
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Re: Sooo...my thoughts...

Post by Nightrider » Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:31 am

danielma wrote: No, no I know...my tone came across wrong in that.

I was also throwing my hat into the same arguement...essentially we were agreeing, just my tone came off wrong :) So yeah we were essentially agreeing, sorry for the miscommunicated tone.
It's cool ...As long as we agree which version we like and which version give a stink eye to! :D
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